m-u-f-c Message Board

 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Poll

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    m-u-f-c.co.uk Forum Index -> m-u-f-c General Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  

General consensus on Mourinho is..
He's still the man for the job
28%
 28%  [ 4 ]
I'm still unsure
28%
 28%  [ 4 ]
#JoseOut
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Nic is still a cunt
42%
 42%  [ 6 ]
Total Votes : 14

Author Message
dark-shade-of-red



Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 5769
Location: Wiltshire

PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 11:45 am    Post subject: Poll Reply with quote

Well, it's cup weekend so a little bit of a shit post, but let's get an overall opinion
_________________
"United's success has generated its wealth; City's wealth has generated its success. Anything else is just piss and wind."

Cheerful Sid
Posted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:02 pm
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Southern Red



Joined: 08 May 2010
Posts: 2438
Location: Haywards Heath

PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As frustrating as things have been this season now is no time to call for Jose to go.

Last season we finished 6th. This season we are looking to finish 2nd. Considering how competitive the league that's pretty good.

People will say Jose's spent shit loads of money. Nobody can argue against that. Put it into context and its a different story. We were a club in serious decline. Taking city out of the equation we actually have a decent points tally. Because we've had so many new faces come in it will take time for the team to gel.

Another argument used against Jose is our style of play... it hasn't been great. But compare it to the rest of the league only 3 teams are consistently play good football. The fact 2 of these teams are our big rivals, it's painful. IMO football hasn't been that bad. We are just comparing it to what city have.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
dark-shade-of-red



Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 5769
Location: Wiltshire

PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Southern Red wrote:
As frustrating as things have been this season now is no time to call for Jose to go.

Last season we finished 6th. This season we are looking to finish 2nd. Considering how competitive the league that's pretty good.

People will say Jose's spent shit loads of money. Nobody can argue against that. Put it into context and its a different story. We were a club in serious decline. Taking city out of the equation we actually have a decent points tally. Because we've had so many new faces come in it will take time for the team to gel.

Another argument used against Jose is our style of play... it hasn't been great. But compare it to the rest of the league only 3 teams are consistently play good football. The fact 2 of these teams are our big rivals, it's painful. IMO football hasn't been that bad. We are just comparing it to what city have.



Can't argue with that and agree on your points.

The clinical finishing has to improve from the forwards and Jose has to really be open-minded to tactical persuasion.

Pogba is not a box to box CM.
_________________
"United's success has generated its wealth; City's wealth has generated its success. Anything else is just piss and wind."

Cheerful Sid
Posted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:02 pm
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
pdl



Joined: 20 Dec 2003
Posts: 1151

PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Got a mate who's an arsenal fan, we give him grief for doing the hokey pokey, "Wenger in, Wenger out" every other game. My question to him is "Who would you replace him with?" Might want to think about that before we pitch Jose
_________________
“You wait. Everyone has an Antarctic.”
― Thomas Pynchon, V.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dark-shade-of-red



Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 5769
Location: Wiltshire

PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pdl wrote:
Got a mate who's an arsenal fan, we give him grief for doing the hokey pokey, "Wenger in, Wenger out" every other game. My question to him is "Who would you replace him with?" Might want to think about that before we pitch Jose


Ancelotti or Pochettino.
_________________
"United's success has generated its wealth; City's wealth has generated its success. Anything else is just piss and wind."

Cheerful Sid
Posted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:02 pm
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Southern Red



Joined: 08 May 2010
Posts: 2438
Location: Haywards Heath

PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dark-shade-of-red wrote:
pdl wrote:
Got a mate who's an arsenal fan, we give him grief for doing the hokey pokey, "Wenger in, Wenger out" every other game. My question to him is "Who would you replace him with?" Might want to think about that before we pitch Jose


Ancelotti or Pochettino.

dark-shade-of-red wrote:
pdl wrote:
Got a mate who's an arsenal fan, we give him grief for doing the hokey pokey, "Wenger in, Wenger out" every other game. My question to him is "Who would you replace him with?" Might want to think about that before we pitch Jose


Ancelotti or Pochettino.

Why Poch? Ok, he's done well at Spurs but he's won fuck all. His team, although play some good football, tend to bottle it just before crossing the finish line. I'm not for one second suggesting he won't come good. It's probable he will. But do you scrap the last two years and start all over again, for a fourth time since Fergie stepped down? And will we be patient enough to give the new guy more than 2 season Of rebuilding? Also, how would he handle the huge egos in our squad? Right now it would be a gamble imo
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
dark-shade-of-red



Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 5769
Location: Wiltshire

PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 1:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Southern Red wrote:
dark-shade-of-red wrote:
pdl wrote:
Got a mate who's an arsenal fan, we give him grief for doing the hokey pokey, "Wenger in, Wenger out" every other game. My question to him is "Who would you replace him with?" Might want to think about that before we pitch Jose


Ancelotti or Pochettino.

dark-shade-of-red wrote:
pdl wrote:
Got a mate who's an arsenal fan, we give him grief for doing the hokey pokey, "Wenger in, Wenger out" every other game. My question to him is "Who would you replace him with?" Might want to think about that before we pitch Jose


Ancelotti or Pochettino.

Why Poch? Ok, he's done well at Spurs but he's won fuck all. His team, although play some good football, tend to bottle it just before crossing the finish line. I'm not for one second suggesting he won't come good. It's probable he will. But do you scrap the last two years and start all over again, for a fourth time since Fergie stepped down? And will we be patient enough to give the new guy more than 2 season Of rebuilding? Also, how would he handle the huge egos in our squad? Right now it would be a gamble imo



Well, in this modern era of football, I don't think you can solely rely on the availability of managers to have won titles elsewhere, because they're all spoken for at other clubs. There are new generations of decent young managers who need a chance to prove themselves now and it's an attractive proposition to hire a manager who has a decent set of values for the game, man-manage well and demonstrate a superior tactical style of football.

After Pep, Jose and whoever is managing Juve, there are no top flight, respected league managers out there who are available. Managers are at clubs for so few seasons now, that they don't get a chance even at the highest level to prove they can win at the very top. Hence lack of choice for the likes of Arsenal and Chelsea should they wish to replace their managers.

I love how he sets his team up to attack and sensibly defend at the same time. Look at how quickly he improved Southampton and developed their youth team for the short while he was there. He then moves in to Spurs, who were more or less never in the top 4 except one season under old 'Arry. Bare in mind, Poch had next to no experience in the league and has turned Spurs in to a formidable force in the league - Spurs!

I love the way he develops young British talent at the club and they seems to excel under his leadership.

He's one for the future for sure. So far, he's only had a few years at Espanyol in a league dominated by Real and Barca. To then manage Southampton for a season. What do you expect him to have won? He manages Spur's transfer policy incredibly well considering what he's up against.

Yes, a body blow for them to not have won the league Leicester had done so, but he's a young manager and will learn from that mistake. Fergie certainly blew our chance in '95. Or 'bottled' it if you like - especially in that fateful season of 2011/2012.
_________________
"United's success has generated its wealth; City's wealth has generated its success. Anything else is just piss and wind."

Cheerful Sid
Posted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:02 pm
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Southern Red



Joined: 08 May 2010
Posts: 2438
Location: Haywards Heath

PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does Jose's comments after tuesday and todays 12 minute rant change anything?

I'm leaning towards thinking he's losing it. He's busy trying to convince us how much he's improved us (and up until now I've given him the benefit of doubt) but the reality is that we failed to beat a poor team over two legs. It happens. It did when he was Porto manager. The difference, against Porto we were far superior and were unlucky. Against Seville over both legs we deserved to lose. Seville weren't lucky, like Porto. Just better! That result reminded me of Moyes defeat to Sunderland in the League cup over 2 legs. The moment where the hope that the manager might manage to turn it around to the acceptance that it's not going to happen. The beginning of the end.

I still wouldn't say Jose needs to be sacked, but I certainly wouldn't be arsed if he was. My worry is no matter the manager, no matter the signings (just look how many 'superstars' we've signed but failed to impress ) I have no confidence things will get better anytime soon. Like Zoo suggested on the other thread, we have seriously deep rooted problems.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
dark-shade-of-red



Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 5769
Location: Wiltshire

PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He's done a Rafa facht rant.

Embarrassing.
_________________
"United's success has generated its wealth; City's wealth has generated its success. Anything else is just piss and wind."

Cheerful Sid
Posted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:02 pm
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
john smith



Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Posts: 6771

PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2018 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dark-shade-of-red wrote:
He's done a Rafa facht rant.

Embarrassing.


it was like Rafa, Kev Keegan and steve Maclaren rolled into one car crash press conference .
he is becoming the empoerer in the fable, riding round naked while people laugh , and yet he thinks he is dressed in the finest clothes.

i would vote Nic is still a cunt Wink

BUT , nic called it about a year ago when he labelled Jose the New Tony Pulis, that's the nail hit right on the head, he has no attacking tactical nouse, he knows how to stiffle and defend, and if you work that in ,and then have a Drogba or a Ronaldo or a Lukaku you can hoof it around up front and snatch goals and win games.
his tactics and style are dated and so is his method of management.
pep came in and realised you can't expect to win with two ex arsenal full backs sagna and clichy , both too old for the game he wanted to play, so he paid a lot of money and he changed them
jose has taken two of our oldest players , who were wingers ,and he expects us to compete by making them full backs.
the fact Young and Valencia have been so adaptable and willing is down to their hard work, and efforts.
but it has showed we have no forward thinking game plan , it's like he looks one game ahead instead of building for the future,you then throw in his love of fellaini, a horrible footballer with the creative ability of a camel, and you can see why Jose is failing, he simply doesnt know how to create a flair team, even when we were bullying sides 4-0 at the start of the season, anyone with a brain could see there was no tactical plane, we simply went out, had better players and won.
well he has had nearly two seasons. plus he had 6 months before he joined where he knew he was coming and quite frankly i believe we are no further forward, the cries of "we're second in the league behind a great City side " are deluded.
the only reason we are second is because
vermin can't defend, if they could they'd be challenging city
spurs are soft and always have been,
Chelsea won the league and then second season they can't be arsed, they do it every time. their performance against city 2 weeks ago was appalling, they simply do /did not give a fuck.
and arsenal are arsenal , enough said.



everything anyone feared would happen with Jose , is starting to look like it's happening,

imho, he should go in the summer and be replaced with a younger more attacking minded manager,



evertime a shite job comes up, the same names are trotted out, the Warnocks and Allardyce and hughes, pardew , hodgson etc etc

everytime we discuss it, its always the same, Anchelotti or Pochetino or ....
the $65 million dollar question and problem is, who the fucking fuck is there... ???? Confused Very Happy
_________________
People say I'm condescending. That means i talk down to people
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Jackl



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1116
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne

PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2018 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The central point was right about the relatively poor investment since 2013. The delivery seemed to me more defensively Van Gaal than the aggressive personal attacks behind those of Rafa and Kev. SAF did have his way of provoking such reactions. No one has provoked Jose except for a couple of minor spats with Conte and Frank de Boer, in both of which he went well beyond the necessary in retaliation.

It has taken City ten years of massive (sometimes wasteful but also good in fundamentals - I would add Kompany to his list) investment to reach the stage when they can truly look forward to a dominant three years and it is investment which preceded the current hierarchy. United would be in a better position now if he'd got the job in 2013 and there is no doubt the ensuing three years worsened the situation just as happened when Sir Matt retired.

It isn't a coincidence that a largely Jose team at Madrid which had no experience of QF CL went on, after he had left, to win 3 in 4 years, nor that a relative stranger to European success in Inter achieved it in 2010. That was really his message and he was telling us also that, for all the hype about the biggest team in the world, the results in the past don't always bear it out.

There is nothing untrue about this. It is welcome realism and it demonstrates he has a plan. Very probably he doesn't expect to be around to reap the benefit. Whether it works either in part or whole we will have to wait and see but if, as he says, the club is on board with 'the process' then there is nothing much else we can do.

The medium on this occasion, as so often, detracted from the message but I excuse that because it is a vipers' nest. Jose's emotions got the better of him in the need to defend himself.

Me, I'm going to support them against Brighton the same as it is always was.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
john smith



Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Posts: 6771

PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2018 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jackl wrote:
The central point was right about the relatively poor investment since 2013. The delivery seemed to me more defensively Van Gaal than the aggressive personal attacks behind those of Rafa and Kev. SAF did have his way of provoking such reactions. No one has provoked Jose except for a couple of minor spats with Conte and Frank de Boer, in both of which he went well beyond the necessary in retaliation.

It has taken City ten years of massive (sometimes wasteful but also good in fundamentals - I would add Kompany to his list) investment to reach the stage when they can truly look forward to a dominant three years and it is investment which preceded the current hierarchy. United would be in a better position now if he'd got the job in 2013 and there is no doubt the ensuing three years worsened the situation just as happened when Sir Matt retired.

It isn't a coincidence that a largely Jose team at Madrid which had no experience of QF CL went on, after he had left, to win 3 in 4 years, nor that a relative stranger to European success in Inter achieved it in 2010. That was really his message and he was telling us also that, for all the hype about the biggest team in the world, the results in the past don't always bear it out.

There is nothing untrue about this. It is welcome realism and it demonstrates he has a plan. Very probably he doesn't expect to be around to reap the benefit. Whether it works either in part or whole we will have to wait and see but if, as he says, the club is on board with 'the process' then there is nothing much else we can do.

The medium on this occasion, as so often, detracted from the message but I excuse that because it is a vipers' nest. Jose's emotions got the better of him in the need to defend himself.

Me, I'm going to support them against Brighton the same as it is always was.


as will we all i believe.

good post too.
_________________
People say I'm condescending. That means i talk down to people
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Zoolander



Joined: 06 Mar 2004
Posts: 5944
Location: Duck Fat City Limits

PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2018 4:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jackl wrote:
The central point was right about the relatively poor investment since 2013.
.


We've spent more since SAF retired than we did in the entire 27 years he was out manager so this "point" is absolute patent bollocks!

The investment has been there in terms of funds but manager after manager has spent the funds appallingly. SAF started it, Moyes, LVG and José have just continued it.

The whole football side of the club needs a total rethink.
_________________
The situation regarding spoons remains unchanged, if I see one, I will kill it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Jackl



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1116
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne

PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2018 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think he was criticising the club for a lack of investment from 2013 just that the quality was poor (in his view). SAF was fond of saying there was no value in the market and City certainly paid over the top but value isn't always short term. Was SAF right or wrong?

ThIs makes Jose's point a fair one even though one could level the same accusation at him. Can we really however say right now that Pogba is a waste of money or does he have the potential to prove the investment worthwhile? In Mkhi's case, is his failure the result of an inability to play the manager's way or the fact that he was ultimately a Dortmund / Arsenal player at heart and he couldn't cut it at this level of expectation?

I can't be sure at the moment and I guess I have to trust the narrative coming out of the club and give it until the end of the season before forming any conclusion contrary to the rather hopeful one I started out with.

I am very gratified, incidentally, to see we seem to have a U18 team again.

Yes, I am sure we will all be rooting for the team.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    m-u-f-c.co.uk Forum Index -> m-u-f-c General Forum All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group