m-u-f-c Message Board

 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Brighton
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    m-u-f-c.co.uk Forum Index -> m-u-f-c General Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
north country boy



Joined: 13 Aug 2004
Posts: 2788
Location: in the area

PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/english-soccer/ken-early-mourinho-s-tactics-undermine-pogba-and-sanchez-1.3431976

Brilliant article by Ken Early there. He fuckin hates Mourinho and its hard to listen to him talk about him at times because his disdain for him is so obvious but his print journalism is excellent, and its equally hard to disagree with any of his points there.

I've made my feelings on Mourinho well known on here so no point in going over them, I've never been as disillusioned as I am though as a United fan. I nearly felt sympathy for Moyes, given how grossly unqualified he was for the job and how he was slaughtered by all and sundry. With LVG I actually had a soft spot for him and wanted it to work out.

Mourinho however is just so utterly unlikeable, and his mask has slipped the last couple weeks - He was on his best behaviour last season but this season we've all seen the Mourinho we all came to hate when he was spreading his poison at other clubs.

I can only see this going one way to be honest, same way it goes once he signs a new contract at every other club - He'll be gone with a massive payout in the next 6-9 months. I just hope he doesn't get rid of players that his successor could use properly in the meantime.
_________________
4-4-2 > 3-5-2
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail MSN Messenger
Stig



Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Posts: 4462

PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good article.

Match of the Day - Shearer, I think, did an analysis where he showed United players not passing to Smalling and Jones and Smalling and Jones not moving into space -- he noted that they clearly had been told not to be part of the playing the ball out process.

So we are a highly expensive Wimbledon.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
john smith



Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Posts: 6714

PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think that article has eloquently summed up what we all have seen with our own eyes,
for example we watch city and vermin and spurs ,pass in all areas, build through the back and pass, hard and sharp into feet, they move off for each other, create triangles and space and work their positions and overlap men and look to attack, the movement from some sides you watch makes us look we'e watching blind or walking football at utd.

we avoid the midfield and hoof it .

it's fucking awful and we've been saying it for months.

what will be the point giving him another £300 million , he can buy Veratti, and bale, and Ali , and, fuck me even Salah and it will make no difference if he sticks to the same shite tactics.
Rolling Eyes
_________________
People say I'm condescending. That means i talk down to people
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Chubby



Joined: 18 Dec 2003
Posts: 3580

PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

north country boy wrote:
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/english-soccer/ken-early-mourinho-s-tactics-undermine-pogba-and-sanchez-1.3431976

Brilliant article by Ken Early there. He fuckin hates Mourinho and its hard to listen to him talk about him at times because his disdain for him is so obvious but his print journalism is excellent, and its equally hard to disagree with any of his points there.



Interesting article. I'd be interested to know if Jose is not playing out from the back because we don't have the centre-backs to do so with ease, perhaps this is why he seems to like Blind in that position, perhaps why he bought in Lindelof? Jones or Smalling aren't anything other than old-fashioned centre-backs, would any of us feel confident with them playing it out from the back? With this constraint It seems logical to me that you'd get the ball out wide, with Valencia and Young/Shaw they're clearly in place to provide the additional width, whilst the left/right forwards being more inside-left or inside-right forwards in old money.

I don't think many would complain if we sold Jones and Smalling and got a couple in that can actually play a little.
_________________
Nic... I dare say you could kick everyone's arse on Mastermind with United as your specialist subject.... Pedantic wank-wipe.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Jackl



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1084
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne

PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That article oversimplifies the situation. I have nothing against Jose adapting his tactics for particular opposition and his reasoning is sound enough. We did it against Barca in 2008 to great effect but came unstuck trying to take them on at their own game in 2009 and 2011. Equally I understand if he sometimes gets it wrong or his players don't execute correctly.

Clearly it's not right that he always does this as Pogba has had some outstanding matches against good teams and bad and some poor ones also whatever the opposition. Alexis has been shoe-horned into a dysfunctional team and too much has been expected of him too soon. The reality is Pogba is not performing and I personally think that has more to do with the fact he is too wound up in his own image and social life. He has really gone off the boil and he is deluded if he thinks that is not in large part down to him.

It also disrespects the immense efforts Lukaku has made to up his game to suggest that it is somehow because Jose is helping him at the expense of others.

There are of course issues about whether Jose knows his best team, or whether he is adaptable enough (too stubborn to change his methods when they are not working) and he has to prove he can overcome those. I don't think it is as simple though as saying these customised tactics prevent would be world class players from influencing games.

My grouse with him was the public humiliation of Shaw which I thought unnecessary. It was also misdirected because his misdemeanours were small. I wouldn't knock Alexis either because I have never seen him not put in a shift and he often tries the unorthodox. On the other hand the press treat Pogba as if he should be untouchable but he is the one who is in danger of becoming just another flat track bully.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Chubby



Joined: 18 Dec 2003
Posts: 3580

PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shaw is apparently training at Carrington, having been given time off during the Intl break. This is exactly the thing he should be doing, and exactly the thing he wouldn’t be doing if he was feeling humiliated. Good on him, best way to answer any criticism is with a football.
_________________
Nic... I dare say you could kick everyone's arse on Mastermind with United as your specialist subject.... Pedantic wank-wipe.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
john smith



Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Posts: 6714

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

have i remembered this incorrectly, but didn't shaw take a personal trainer on pre season holiday last year to get himself in shape ?
or was that someone else ??
_________________
People say I'm condescending. That means i talk down to people
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Southern Red



Joined: 08 May 2010
Posts: 2342
Location: Haywards Heath

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 8:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

john smith wrote:
have i remembered this incorrectly, but didn't shaw take a personal trainer on pre season holiday last year to get himself in shape ?
or was that someone else ??

Yes, he did.

This view that he is an unfit pizza eater is far from the reality.

Being out for so long with his leg break, of course he became unfit. Who wouldn't? Perhaps it took a bit longer than it should for the penny to drop and realise it was time to get fit again. Taking personal trainers on tours etc. As I've said before, apparently he is now one of the fittest players in the squad.

What he does on the pitch... well I don't think he has been worse than anyone else. Is he better than Young? Maybe not. But if he was given a run of games and treated fairly I'm convinced he will be.

Right now Jose is using Shaw as a scapegoat, diverting the negativity away from himself. He is a cunt for doing that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
tafkaf



Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 6405

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 10:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is the weird thing... what does Mourinho think he does so badly? I think he plays well enough when picked. He doesn’t stand out in terms of awfulness to me.
_________________
We have some right mardy twats as fans, Chubby is the worst.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Chubby



Joined: 18 Dec 2003
Posts: 3580

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's the positions he takes up, Tafkaf. He relies on his speed to make up for it, usually it works, but sometimes it doesn't. He doesn't press either, whether he's been told not to is anyone's guess but with him on the pitch the opposition get's more crosses in from that side.
_________________
Nic... I dare say you could kick everyone's arse on Mastermind with United as your specialist subject.... Pedantic wank-wipe.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
north country boy



Joined: 13 Aug 2004
Posts: 2788
Location: in the area

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chubby wrote:
It's the positions he takes up, Tafkaf. He relies on his speed to make up for it, usually it works, but sometimes it doesn't. He doesn't press either, whether he's been told not to is anyone's guess but with him on the pitch the opposition get's more crosses in from that side.


Meanwhile Smalling & Jones drop clanger after clanger beside him and don't get near the same criticism.

Its beyond pettiness on Jose's part, his card was marked when he turned him down to sign for Chelsea when he was manager there... and we thought Fergie was some man for baring a grudge!!!
_________________
4-4-2 > 3-5-2
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail MSN Messenger
john smith



Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Posts: 6714

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

north country boy wrote:
Chubby wrote:
It's the positions he takes up, Tafkaf. He relies on his speed to make up for it, usually it works, but sometimes it doesn't. He doesn't press either, whether he's been told not to is anyone's guess but with him on the pitch the opposition get's more crosses in from that side.


Meanwhile Smalling & Jones drop clanger after clanger beside him and don't get near the same criticism.

Its beyond pettiness on Jose's part, his card was marked when he turned him down to sign for Chelsea when he was manager there... and we thought Fergie was some man for baring a grudge!!!


you have to say Jose really does wear blinkers when it suits him, one game early season Pogba was awful , truly shocking and everyone saw it, Jose came out after and said what a game he had had, and how he was world class.

everyone took it with a pinch of salt , and saw it as the manager showing good motivational skill and not raping his player in public.

with shaw he is just the opposite, it's like using your weakest or oldest member of staff , and berating them to prove a point how strong you are to all the other staff, but even a blind man can see through it . i would guess Bastian Schweinstieger would be a case in point too .
_________________
People say I'm condescending. That means i talk down to people
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
tafkaf



Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 6405

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JS, he said Shaw is fat & has to be told what to do all through games... not sure he’s raped him.

Although there are a few games left this season.
_________________
We have some right mardy twats as fans, Chubby is the worst.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Zoolander



Joined: 06 Mar 2004
Posts: 5897
Location: Duck Fat City Limits

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jason Dodd was interviewed recently by the BBC and he said that Shaw really does need a kick up the arse and had to have one constantly at Southampton. Does anyone ever recall this happening in public when Shaw was a Southampton player?

It's not what you do it's how you do it.

Maybe 'IF' Shaw needs this constant arse kicking then we shouldn't have bought him, so sell him.

Maybe 'IF' Shaw needs this constant arse kicking you do it in private in a constructive and inspiring way that befalls a management position that attracts a £5m+ pay packet.

Do you do it in a spiteful way in public whilst other players just as poor and some more so don't even get a mention?

What if José's frankly baffling tactics are confusing the lad? Maybe he's not sure if he should press, stay back in position ,push forward and overlap, brush the stands, fold a blanket, walk the dog?

The manager may not have bought him to the club but it's certainly his job to get the best out of him or shift him on, no where does it say that his job is to ridicule him.

For my money Shaw hasn't shown enough to still be here but I cannot condone the way the manager has targeted him and singled him out, it's shocking.

At the end of the day it comes down to this, he's an asset that needs to be managed, you either get the best out of him or the best price for him, Jose is doing neither.
_________________
The situation regarding spoons remains unchanged, if I see one, I will kill it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Dee



Joined: 19 Dec 2003
Posts: 649

PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A hypothetical question, do you think the performances would be better if Pep was in charge? I know what I think, and it all rides on Jose at the moment.
_________________
"I think Manchester United is the greatest team in the world. I'd give anything to play for you" - Duncan Edwards.

"The only player who ever made me feel inferior" - Sir Bobby Charlton.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    m-u-f-c.co.uk Forum Index -> m-u-f-c General Forum All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Page 4 of 5

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group