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Young Boys (h)
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The Dave



Joined: 22 Dec 2003
Posts: 1476

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:31 pm    Post subject: Young Boys (h) Reply with quote

Well I cheered the winner. Two United fans I was with stayed stony-faced. Anyone else that desperate to get rid of Mourinho?? Laughing Laughing
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TOFB



Joined: 27 Jan 2004
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Location: Cavan, Ireland

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A wins a win. Blimey United did make it difficult though. Rashford showing why he’ll never be a main striker for us. De Gea with another great save to ensure he doesn’t leave his line for another season at least. Wink
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The Dave



Joined: 22 Dec 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TOFB wrote:
A wins a win. Blimey United did make it difficult though. Rashford showing why he’ll never be a main striker for us. De Gea with another great save to ensure he doesn’t leave his line for another season at least. Wink


Yeah Rashford and Martial are close to done at this level. Perhaps their futures would've been different under a different manager, but we'll never know.

It's harsh to pick on individuals when everyone is playing this poorly but I've seen enough.
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Stig



Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Posts: 4515

PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think he has ruined Rashford.

The lad has missed at least four one on ones this year; he's devoid of confidence.
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Southern Red



Joined: 08 May 2010
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Location: Haywards Heath

PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:30 am    Post subject: Re: Young Boys (h) Reply with quote

The Dave wrote:
Well I cheered the winner. Two United fans I was with stayed stony-faced. Anyone else that desperate to get rid of Mourinho?? Laughing Laughing

I felt nothing when we got that winner. All I want is a bit of hope. I saw nothing in that game to back me believe we are about to turn a corner. It a lucky 1-0 win with a scabby hand ball goal against a team at the level of a championship club and my 'cheer' reflected that

I still believe both Rashford and Martial will come good under different management. Jose has put far too much pressure on the lads. The look on his face when Rashford missed that first one... what young striker would cope playing for one of the biggest clubs in the world, going through their worst period in 30 years and the scrutiny that comes with that, and a manager ready to rip of your head and shit down your throat 'coz he thinks you are one of the reasons his jobs on the line.

Compare Rashford with sterling... sterling misses those chances every week but many still talk about him like he's one of the best in the world. The difference, sterling is at a club where other players can take the pressure off you. He can enjoy his football because the fuck ups are not be magnified. Put Rashford in the city team and I don't think sterling gets a game. He would enjoy himself, like the player we saw in those early days where there was no pressure on him. Im sure his performances/decision making would reflect that.


Last edited by Southern Red on Wed Nov 28, 2018 9:47 am; edited 1 time in total
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john smith



Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Posts: 6772

PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

can't wait for the draw to find out which shite low level euro side will be knocking us out on away goals in the last 16 ......... Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad Rolling Eyes

last night was absolutely fucking awful.... he may be a cock but when Robbie savage says
"this is meant to be man utd , what we are seeing here is appalling"

you know you are shite!!

and throwing the water bottles about at the end ....... o jose do fuck off ,and please do it now.
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Nicolae



Joined: 18 Dec 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:43 am    Post subject: Re: Young Boys (h) Reply with quote

Southern Red wrote:
Put Rashford in the city team and I don't think sterling gets a game.


Very Happy Very Happy Razz Razz Very Happy Very Happy Razz Razz
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Chubby



Joined: 18 Dec 2003
Posts: 3685

PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rashford is a wide player, not a striker. Martial is a striker, not a winger. Both played out of position. Midfield was awful, Pogba gave us some urgency and flair when he came on. Lukaku has done the square root of fuck-all this season. We are misfiring at home and misfiring up front, I'm at a loss to understand why we play better away from home, but at a bigger loss to understand why we can't create chances with the players we have. Jose got lucky last night. I would not have wanted to go to Valencia needing a result, and that's exactly how far the standards have dropped.

De Gea was his usual liability of a GK last night Rolling Eyes Laughing

I can't remember the last time I looked forward to a United game, probably Jose's first season. I dread them at the moment, not for the potential for a bad result but for the potential of being bored to death by the football on show. I get neither the highest highs or the lowest lows, it's just all a bit meh.
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TOFB



Joined: 27 Jan 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chubby wrote:
De Gea was his usual liability of a GK last night Rolling Eyes Laughing

https://youtu.be/7OnMStcfLAM
A Ben Foster saves compilation for you. Wink
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Chubby



Joined: 18 Dec 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TOFB wrote:
Chubby wrote:
De Gea was his usual liability of a GK last night Rolling Eyes Laughing

https://youtu.be/7OnMStcfLAM
A Ben Foster saves compilation for you. Wink


It would be equally as sensible to link various episodes showing Glipton Grasshoppers in Jossy’s Giants,
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TOFB



Joined: 27 Jan 2004
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Location: Cavan, Ireland

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 1:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chubby wrote:
TOFB wrote:
Chubby wrote:
De Gea was his usual liability of a GK last night Rolling Eyes Laughing

https://youtu.be/7OnMStcfLAM
A Ben Foster saves compilation for you. Wink


It would be equally as sensible to link various episodes showing Glipton Grasshoppers in Jossy’s Giants,

Will have to find a few more shot stopping reels so. Particularly with the clawing-out action, that is particularly aesthetically pleasing in highlights reels. Maybe Shay Given or Joe Hart have a few...
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Zoolander



Joined: 06 Mar 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chubby wrote:
Rashford is a wide player, not a striker. Martial is a striker, not a winger. Both played out of position.
.


Sorry but for me this attitude/notion is part of the problem.

Rashford & Martial are forwards, as soon as we start to say they can each only play in one particular position in one particular formation or style we've got the wrong players. If they can't cope they aren't good enough.

Where does Ronaldo play? Left wing, right wing, up front, in the hole? Arguably he'd do a fucking brilliant job anywhere up front, anywhere in midfield and probably at full back too.

You don't see German, Dutch or Brazilian players describing themselves in terms of specific positions, they say "I'm a defender" or "I'm a forward". Anyone we develop or buy should be the same. Limiting anyone to just one position is ridiculous, they are professional footballers for heavens sake. They'll have a preferred position granted and maybe they'll shine in a particular position or formation but suggesting that is all they are capable of is to admit they really aren't that good. If that's the case let's get rid.

I'm technical manager in work but that doesn't mean I don't know how to process an order in the warehouse or how to close out a customer and get an order. I'm sure 99% of us here are the same we can all do a bit of our colleagues jobs. We'd still be effective if we had to cover for a day in that role. Why do we accept anything less from players that in the grand scheme of things are in the top 1-2% to be a professional at a club in the top half of the premier league, playing in the champions league and a capped international?

Rashford & Martial should both be capable of playing up front in a two, anywhere along the front line in a three or out wide in a 4-4-2. If they aren't and we are admitting that, then ship 'em out and find better. Modern football demands flexibility and dynamic movement, a full back may find themselves the furthest forward player during an attack and they ought to be able to deal with that if they want Man Utd player on their CV.

Fed up of excuses for shit house poor performances.
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north country boy



Joined: 13 Aug 2004
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Location: in the area

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Genuinely pains me to say this but watching the vermin against PSG last night, players on both teams working their socks off, even sprinting at times, the bleedin show-offs!!!

But seriously we are light years behind them. Both managers setting up their teams the way United should be set up: flair, hard work, guile, imagination... all lacking from United under Mourinho.

Heard the other night that both Fulham and Cardiff (two Championship teams last season) have scored more home goals this season than we have. I'm sorry but that is unforgiveable.

Have a feeling it all could end with the ultimate indignity on Saturday - Getting beaten by a Mark Hughes managed side.
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The Dave



Joined: 22 Dec 2003
Posts: 1476

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 1:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMO Martial was never gonna make it with us - I thought that in his first season. Got some skills but no footballing brain and rarely ever a final product. And only one finish.

Rashford is still one of my favourite United players and perhaps the only player in our squad who I get excited by when he's got the ball at his feet and space in front of him. But I've seen him miss way too many one-on-ones for club and country, and the general inconsistency of his performances suggests he's not a 'top club' player.

I honestly don't know how much Mourinho can be blamed for either of them, but whatever happens in the future these guys won't get these vital years of their development back.
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Chubby



Joined: 18 Dec 2003
Posts: 3685

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zoolander wrote:
Chubby wrote:
Rashford is a wide player, not a striker. Martial is a striker, not a winger. Both played out of position.
.


Sorry but for me this attitude/notion is part of the problem.

Rashford & Martial are forwards, as soon as we start to say they can each only play in one particular position in one particular formation or style we've got the wrong players. If they can't cope they aren't good enough.

Where does Ronaldo play? Left wing, right wing, up front, in the hole? Arguably he'd do a fucking brilliant job anywhere up front, anywhere in midfield and probably at full back too.

You don't see German, Dutch or Brazilian players describing themselves in terms of specific positions, they say "I'm a defender" or "I'm a forward". Anyone we develop or buy should be the same. Limiting anyone to just one position is ridiculous, they are professional footballers for heavens sake. They'll have a preferred position granted and maybe they'll shine in a particular position or formation but suggesting that is all they are capable of is to admit they really aren't that good. If that's the case let's get rid.

I'm technical manager in work but that doesn't mean I don't know how to process an order in the warehouse or how to close out a customer and get an order. I'm sure 99% of us here are the same we can all do a bit of our colleagues jobs. We'd still be effective if we had to cover for a day in that role. Why do we accept anything less from players that in the grand scheme of things are in the top 1-2% to be a professional at a club in the top half of the premier league, playing in the champions league and a capped international?

Rashford & Martial should both be capable of playing up front in a two, anywhere along the front line in a three or out wide in a 4-4-2. If they aren't and we are admitting that, then ship 'em out and find better. Modern football demands flexibility and dynamic movement, a full back may find themselves the furthest forward player during an attack and they ought to be able to deal with that if they want Man Utd player on their CV.

Fed up of excuses for shit house poor performances.


Sorry Zoo but this is utter drivel.

1. Martial will score if you play him as a striker, proven to be the case and the stats are self evident. He's a mildly effective winger too, but his best position is as a striker. He's plenty good enough if played correctly.

2. Rashford is not clinical enough to play as a striker, proven to be the case as the stats are self evident. He should be out on the wing, using his obvious talents to create chances for others. He will never be a 20-30 goal-a-season striker, doesn't mean he isn't good enough.

3. Comparing either of these two to Ronaldo's ability is bonkers, because in the last 140 years of football few have had the ability Ronaldo has. If he's the benchmark then in the next 140 years most will fail.

4. What is a forward? It's not a position. If I say to any of my u12s the position they'll be playing as a forward they'll look confused. Not all forwards can play at 9, or 10. Not all forwards can play at 7 or 11.

5. All premier league players can play anywhere, with perhaps the exception of goalkeeper but it's absolutely bonkers to not play them where they're strongest and then expect generalists to be as good as specialists, be that in your arbitrary "defender" or "forward" comment. I would argue that we have too many generalists, not enough specialists, RvN was as specialist as it came, he was fucking brilliant because of it, put him on the wing and he'd have been a 10th of the player he was, according to your perspective RvN would not be good enough for us. Rolling Eyes

These are not excuses for poor performances and neither did I say they were, but perhaps things worth considering if we want performances to improve. Playing players where they'll have the biggest impact is hardly rocket science, now is it?

So stick that up your arse and smoke it. Laughing
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